To start off, I'm a Christian turned Agnostic...or rather I should say a very poor Christian turned Agnostic. I was never any good when I claimed to be Christian. I didn't believe anything more than 60% of the 10 commandments and that God existed. And despite believing in God's existence I never really "loved" him. I was (and still am) more terrified of him than anything else.
Over time I just grew to dislike what I was being taught in church and Sunday school and decided (to my mother's great dislike) to not go to church anymore. So now I'm a self described agnostic who's still stuck with this awkward and irrational (or perhaps very rational...) fear and slight disdain for a being I'm not sure even exists. However, to me agnosticism is a pretty annoying to position to stay stuck in. A continual "I don't know" isn't a satisfying enough answer for me. I think that there is a single answer that exists for any objective question. And when it comes down to the existence of God the answer can either be yes or no.
So this will be set up with two separate lists of questions, one geared towards Christians and the other towards Atheists. It's a bit of an experiment if you will. A part of me wants to be convinced one way or the other and this is the best way that I can come up with. So before I set this up I must set up my rules for how this will be handled:
1) No flaming or harassing others on the basis of belief. I don't want to see ridiculous, unnecessary arguing or flame baiting among anyone. Any rude, hateful comments will be hidden immediately. Basically, if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all. Remember that there are human beings on the other end of the computer screen. Don't abuse your anonymity.
2) No sarcastic "cool story, bro" type comments. No one or two word comments. I'm looking for well thought out discussion based comments.
3) Atheists can answer the Christian questions and Christians can answer the Atheist questions so long as the answers aren't sarcastic and mean spirited.
Questions for Christians
1) In regards to hell, should it ever be someone's sole reason for wanting to convert to Christianity?
Now whenever I state that the only reason I have to consider converting is this idea of hell as a place of pure torture, I always get this "Oh, you shouldn't convert just because of that!" sort of answer. However this idea is very confusing. One thing that Christians are supposed to be doing are "saving" people from going to hell, yet they don't think that a person should convert solely because they're afraid of hell. Why? Is it somehow wrong to turn to God because you afraid of the punishment that might be suffered after death? So is it really that wrong to believe because you don't want to deal with the alternative?
2) Also in regards to hell, what is it? Is it a place of pure torture or is it just separation from God? Or perhaps some mix of both?
I've heard them both. That hell is this extremely painful place of physical and mental torture forever and ever. Or that it's a separation of God and a place for people to wallow in their sins for all eternity. If hell is a place of mental and physical torture then yes I admit that does scare me. If it's a separation from God and a place where people continue to sin for all eternity, well that really doesn't seem that different that now. It's not nearly as worrying to me. I don't understand what scares people so much about just that.
3) In regards to God's omniscience, power, etc., is he really?
I admit that I wanted to find a different way to word this question, however this is the best and simplest way I could ask it. I ask this question a lot because I never find the answers I get to be satisfactory for too long. I always end up reading something or thinking of something else that makes me question the previous answers I get to this.
I still question this concept. He created everything (including us) knowing that we were going to disobey him. He created Satan knowing Satan was going to disobey him. Why? None of this "because it's the only way that we could have free will..." jargon. I've read that and heard that time and time again. This just leads me to ask, why then is free will entirely necessary? I don't believe it is. It seems that free will was a personal choice on God's part. It isn't a necessity. If I were made to be without the ability to, would I even know it? Would I really care? Probably not.
Before creating the angels, He should've known that one (Satan) would betray him. Before creating Adam and Eve, He should've known that they would "betray" him (despite their lack of knowledge of good, bad, right, and wrong). He gave them free will so he should've foreseen that happening.
4) What is heaven?
I hear more about hell than heaven when it comes to details. Hell is this fiery pit of despair where sinners dwell in their sins for all eternity. It's dark, scary and you don't want to go there. But what about heaven? What's it supposed to be like? And what if you went there and saw no one you knew...? Would it be possible to be lonely even though God's there (my personal opinion is that it would be)?
5) Why are you right?
Pretty self explanatory question. However no "because the Bible says so" or "because I was taught so" sort of answers. What knowledge or experiences have you gained/had that says to you that this world view is the correct one?
6) On mixing politics and religion...
Christian beliefs seem to be the only ones that get pushed forward in political agendas. Why should your beliefs be pushed onto others? Do you feel like religion is ever used to push forward laws? I'll leave it at that.
7) Why are you a Christian?
Were you taught it? Did you convert after some event in your life? If that's the case, what was it in your life that made you convert? Did you convert during a happy period in your life or a sad one (only answer that if you want to...I know that sometimes the back stories can be tough and you may not want to say it)?
8) Any last words, thoughts, etc.?
Anything you'd wanna add extra to what you've said above.
Questions for Atheists
1) Why are you right?
Exact same question for you guys as for Christians. Only I wanted to start this off with this one. I generally have more questions for Christians than for atheists anyways because Christians have a lot of confusing doctrines to deal with. So why is your world view the correct one?
2) Do you find depressed or relieved thinking/knowing there's no afterlife?
Oddly enough, I've heard both views from Atheists on this. Some feel that it is a little bit of a depressing thought that there is nothing else after this life. Most feel relieved. That way they can treat this life with the utmost respect and live it to the fullest because they know that once this life is over with...it's over with.
3) If you are like this, why do you have such a disdain, bordering on pure hatred, for theists? If you are not like this then there's no need to answer this question.
I have a huge disdain for militant theists. But my disdain for militant atheists seems to be a bit stronger. I don't understand why there is a need for some atheists to call theists stupid, ignorant, and all other sorts of names because they believe something different than they do. The reason my disdain for militant atheists is stronger than that for militant theists is because theists are usually doing what they do because they are instructed to in some way by their god to spread the word. Atheists who do the same thing (I'm only talking about some if you do not fit into the "militant" category then this does not concern you) don't have a real reason. They come across as extremely self-righteous. So if you are like this, why are you? Why shouldn't someone who holds theistic beliefs be considered as smart as someone who doesn't? Admittedly, this question has nothing to do with anything...I'm just very curious about the attitudes some atheists seem to have towards theists/theism.
4) Why are you an Atheist?
Were you raised in an atheist home? Did you convert after some event in your life? If that's the case, what was it in your life that made you convert? Did you convert during a happy period in your life or a sad one (only answer that if you want to...I know that sometimes the back stories can be tough and you may not want to say it)?
5) Any last words, thoughts, etc.?
Anything you'd wanna add extra to what you've said above.
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1. I think Christians don’t want people to convert solely because of hell because then that person’s faith will easily be brought into question. Christianity is about a relationship, not a dictatorship. It’s like a married couple: if a spouse cheats, they will divorce. Now, that’s not the reason they stay in the relationship, it’s just a fact of love. Being unfaithful= separation, and separation from God=hell.
ReplyDelete2. There is a book called 23 Minutes in Hell which might interest you. It’s the testimony of a man who experienced hell in a vision. Something interesting was brought to my attention about the term “separation from God.” Technically, even the unbelievers on Earth are not completely separated. God still causes good things to happen, gives people talents and gifts, and everyone has the capacity to love. In hell, none of this will be possible. There will be nothing good, nothing loving, not even fond memories. As far as torture, all I have to go by is what is in the Bible. Which sounds kinda bad, if you ask me.
This is probably why you are afraid of God, right? He does not want you to fear Him. I know this is hard to grasp, but God doesn’t watch us all the time to catch us red-handed. That’s the demons’ jobs. However, a respect of God’s authority over our lives is necessary to appreciate all of God’s complexity. He loves us, but He must be just. That’s why He sent His Son, to pay the price for our sins so we could more easily have access to heaven (instead of the whole animal sacrifice thing).
3. God is omniscient, and self-sustaining. Everything that you said about His seeing the future is true. But since He can see everything in the future, He knew in the beginning how much He would love each of us, so He created us to love us. Like any groom, however, he doesn’t want the bride (the Church) to be forced to love Him. The idea of free will is still very much debated, but if one considers that He allowed Satan to betray Him in order to give us a choice between Good and Evil, thus allowing us to choose to love God, it makes more sense.
4. Heaven. All I can say is that it will be perfection. God made each one of us with unique attributes and talents, and while some people believe all of heaven will be singing and harp music, I think it will be the place where we can use all of our gifts and talents to their fullest and truest potential. First and foremost, though, it is a place where we will be eternally with Jesus, the Church’s groom.
5. This is a difficult question, because most of it has to do with faith, and things the world cannot accept. There are, however, countless accounts of miraculous healings, prophecies, and other unexplainable events even in this century that happen to and because of Christians. For example, a missions group with fed a crowd of people to satisfaction with 6 PBJs. Every time they reached into their pockets, they just found another sandwich. If Christianity is not right, than Christians are magicians without even trying.
ReplyDelete6. Jesus was not a politician, so though I do base my politics on Biblical standards, I think it is despicable when politicians use God to further their own agendas. Jesus was not republican or democrat. Actually, he was kind of an anarchist. XD
7. I grew up in a Christian family, but I went through a validation period in my teenager years. I also know people who were drug addicts, drunkards, etc. who have been reformed because of Christianity. I believe, though, because it gives me a purpose for my life outside of myself. All that I do I do for Him, and not to further my own life.
8. A big thing that trips up Christians is the dispute between science and God. Most think you cannot have one and the other, but as an aspiring anthropologist, I beg to differ. I’m still struggling on where the truth ends and human “science” begins, but I ask that when you study this you take into accounts all of the pros and cons of both sides, and don’t put God in a box.
I hope this helps. I admire your desire to settle this for yourself in a peaceable way. I hope your search ends well!
1) I have a feeling that that might be right. Though it's a little hard after "warning" people about hell to then tell them that they shouldn't convert just because of hell. In general I must wonder if most or any Christians have some fear of hell on a small scale. Or even on a larger scale.
ReplyDeleteEven then though, if their faith were brought into question, what would you say to such a person? Especially if they did believe in God and accepted Jesus and pray and follow the Bible...what could be said if their entire belief was based on a fear of hell?
2) Maybe it might be interesting. But I wouldn't take it as an actual glimpse of hell. Just that person's interpretation of if. I'm a skeptical believer in things like that. I put visions up there with ghosts and psychics. I don't doubt that people might have such abilities or experiences, however I think it needs to be proven without a reasonable doubt.
Sou ka...I have my doubts about everyone having the capacity to love...(keyword "everyone"). I do believe that some people are born without such an emotion. Sociopaths are one such group of people that come to mind. I rarely claim a capacity to love anything more than animals. I have respect, admiration, and loyalty towards people. I'm fiercely protective and loyal to my friends and those I feel deserve such protection. But love is a term to strong and too...complicated for me to claim for anything.
Still even describing a lack of all things "good"...anything less than physical pain and torture still doesn't sound that bad.
Nope. I fear God because he's immensely powerful. I don't know how anyone couldn't fear (not fear as in respect but fear as in afraid) something that's all powerful. At the same time I fear hell too because I was taught that it was a place of torture. And being a person who hates physical pain I wouldn't be able to stand it. But I'm also a person who wants to stay far away from things she fears. With an understand of what hell is, I could probably get over that fear. But seeing as God can't be placed in a box (as you warned me not to do), more or less likely I won't be able to get over a fear of him so easily.
That and I don't like the unknown. Really I could probably get through life if I knew where I'd end up when I died no matter where it was. I'm sure I'd be pretty depressed if I knew I was going to hell but then I'd just have to make this life count right?
Saying it's the demon's job to watch and catch us red handed...I just don't that. What do demon's have to gain? Why do they care? Isn't God the one who cares the most?
3) Then why create us? It seems like a gamble to me.
7) I suppose that's why I'm a bit envious of Christians...or really anyone of faith. You guys seem to have some sort of purpose for life. I can't find one.
8) I doubt my search will end well. And I highly doubt I'll ever settle it. *shrug*