Convince Me: Questions for Christians and Atheists

To start off, I'm a Christian turned Agnostic...or rather I should say a very poor Christian turned Agnostic. I was never any good when I claimed to be Christian. I didn't believe anything more than 60% of the 10 commandments and that God existed. And despite believing in God's existence I never really "loved" him. I was (and still am) more terrified of him than anything else.

Over time I just grew to dislike what I was being taught in church and Sunday school and decided (to my mother's great dislike) to not go to church anymore. So now I'm a self described agnostic who's still stuck with this awkward and irrational (or perhaps very rational...) fear and slight disdain for a being I'm not sure even exists. However, to me agnosticism is a pretty annoying to position to stay stuck in. A continual "I don't know" isn't a satisfying enough answer for me. I think that there is a single answer that exists for any objective question. And when it comes down to the existence of God the answer can either be yes or no.

So this will be set up with two separate lists of questions, one geared towards Christians and the other towards Atheists. It's a bit of an experiment if you will. A part of me wants to be convinced one way or the other and this is the best way that I can come up with. So before I set this up I must set up my rules for how this will be handled:

1) No flaming or harassing others on the basis of belief. I don't want to see ridiculous, unnecessary arguing or flame baiting among anyone. Any rude, hateful comments will be hidden immediately. Basically, if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all. Remember that there are human beings on the other end of the computer screen. Don't abuse your anonymity.

2) No sarcastic "cool story, bro" type comments. No one or two word comments. I'm looking for well thought out discussion based comments.

3) Atheists can answer the Christian questions and Christians can answer the Atheist questions so long as the answers aren't sarcastic and mean spirited.


Questions for Christians

1) In regards to hell, should it ever be someone's sole reason for wanting to convert to Christianity?

Now whenever I state that the only reason I have to consider converting is this idea of hell as a place of pure torture, I always get this "Oh, you shouldn't convert just because of that!" sort of answer. However this idea is very confusing. One thing that Christians are supposed to be doing are "saving" people from going to hell, yet they don't think that a person should convert solely because they're afraid of hell. Why? Is it somehow wrong to turn to God because you afraid of the punishment that might be suffered after death? So is it really that wrong to believe because you don't want to deal with the alternative?

2) Also in regards to hell, what is it? Is it a place of pure torture or is it just separation from God? Or perhaps some mix of both?

I've heard them both. That hell is this extremely painful place of physical and mental torture forever and ever. Or that it's a separation of God and a place for people to wallow in their sins for all eternity. If hell is a place of mental and physical torture then yes I admit that does scare me. If it's a separation from God and a place where people continue to sin for all eternity, well that really doesn't seem that different that now. It's not nearly as worrying to me. I don't understand what scares people so much about just that.

3) In regards to God's omniscience, power, etc., is he really?

I admit that I wanted to find a different way to word this question, however this is the best and simplest way I could ask it. I ask this question a lot because I never find the answers I get to be satisfactory for too long. I always end up reading something or thinking of something else that makes me question the previous answers I get to this.

I still question this concept. He created everything (including us) knowing that we were going to disobey him. He created Satan knowing Satan was going to disobey him. Why? None of this "because it's the only way that we could have free will..." jargon. I've read that and heard that time and time again. This just leads me to ask, why then is free will entirely necessary? I don't believe it is. It seems that free will was a personal choice on God's part. It isn't a necessity. If I were made to be without the ability to, would I even know it? Would I really care? Probably not.

Before creating the angels, He should've known that one (Satan) would betray him. Before creating Adam and Eve, He should've known that they would "betray" him (despite their lack of knowledge of good, bad, right, and wrong). He gave them free will so he should've foreseen that happening.

4) What is heaven?

I hear more about hell than heaven when it comes to details. Hell is this fiery pit of despair where sinners dwell in their sins for all eternity. It's dark, scary and you don't want to go there. But what about heaven? What's it supposed to be like? And what if you went there and saw no one you knew...? Would it be possible to be lonely even though God's there (my personal opinion is that it would be)?

5) Why are you right?

Pretty self explanatory question. However no "because the Bible says so" or "because I was taught so" sort of answers. What knowledge or experiences have you gained/had that says to you that this world view is the correct one?

6) On mixing politics and religion...

Christian beliefs seem to be the only ones that get pushed forward in political agendas. Why should your beliefs be pushed onto others? Do you feel like religion is ever used to push forward laws? I'll leave it at that.

7) Why are you a Christian?

Were you taught it? Did you convert after some event in your life? If that's the case, what was it in your life that made you convert? Did you convert during a happy period in your life or a sad one (only answer that if you want to...I know that sometimes the back stories can be tough and you may not want to say it)?

8) Any last words, thoughts, etc.?

Anything you'd wanna add extra to what you've said above.

Questions for Atheists

1) Why are you right?

Exact same question for you guys as for Christians. Only I wanted to start this off with this one. I generally have more questions for Christians than for atheists anyways because Christians have a lot of confusing doctrines to deal with. So why is your world view the correct one?

2) Do you find depressed or relieved thinking/knowing there's no afterlife?

Oddly enough, I've heard both views from Atheists on this. Some feel that it is a little bit of a depressing thought that there is nothing else after this life. Most feel relieved. That way they can treat this life with the utmost respect and live it to the fullest because they know that once this life is over with...it's over with.

3) If you are like this, why do you have such a disdain, bordering on pure hatred, for theists? If you are not like this then there's no need to answer this question.

I have a huge disdain for militant theists. But my disdain for militant atheists seems to be a bit stronger. I don't understand why there is a need for some atheists to call theists stupid, ignorant, and all other sorts of names because they believe something different than they do. The reason my disdain for militant atheists is stronger than that for militant theists is because theists are usually doing what they do because they are instructed to in some way by their god to spread the word. Atheists who do the same thing (I'm only talking about some if you do not fit into the "militant" category then this does not concern you) don't have a real reason. They come across as extremely self-righteous. So if you are like this, why are you? Why shouldn't someone who holds theistic beliefs be considered as smart as someone who doesn't? Admittedly, this question has nothing to do with anything...I'm just very curious about the attitudes some atheists seem to have towards theists/theism.

4) Why are you an Atheist?

Were you raised in an atheist home? Did you convert after some event in your life? If that's the case, what was it in your life that made you convert? Did you convert during a happy period in your life or a sad one (only answer that if you want to...I know that sometimes the back stories can be tough and you may not want to say it)?

5) Any last words, thoughts, etc.?

Anything you'd wanna add extra to what you've said above.

This.

How to Share the Gospel with a Pagan

It's an article on Everything Under the Moon's forum entitled "How to Share the Gospel with a Pagan". While I may not be pagan (I'm more agnostic for the moment), I feel that the same statements could apply if you were to switch out "pagan" with any other religion/belief. Everything covered under this subject is for how to share the gospel with anyone.

Don't treat the other party as less than human.

Don't become defensive when you're confronted about the negatives about your religion.

Learn about the other person's beliefs before making assumptions about what they believe.

Don't tell people what they really believe.

Don't attack the other party.

And many other things. I just simplified what this piece of writing elegantly said. To get the entire message I would suggest reading the post.

I'd be lying...

...if I said I didn't hold any ill feelings towards religion. When I say 'religion' I can only speak about Christianity because that's the religion I was brought up to 'believe'.

It's a feeling I tried my best to deny, but there's no denying it. If it seems unfair to have such ill feelings towards on religion, then it's true. It is unfair. However Christianity is the only religion I am familiar with, therefore th only religion I can speak about. Now it could be because I'm so cynical of things. I could be because of my pessimism. There are many different reasons why I've developed such strong cynical feelings towards religion so I guess I'll go through all of them.

Hypocrisy:

There is too much of this within the teaching of the church. The biggest of all being the teaching of love towards all men. However this changes meaning over time. The bible was used to justify racism, bigotry, sexism, and any and all types of prejudice (and still is being used to justify racism and sexism). How can one love everyone and claim that they love everyone when they themselves are hating certain groups of people?

The biggest group being discriminated against at this time would have to be gays and lesbians. Those who are homophobic claim that it is God's desire to have man and woman be together and that they are showing homosexuals love by 'telling' them that God hates them. A couple of problems with this idea...One, the bible states that God loves everyone. So for people to claim that God hates a group of people makes no sense. Two, judgement is a right reserved for God and God only. To make judgement on a person without knowing for sure what God is thinking is wrong and also a sin according to the bible.

Free Will:

This can be debated with me 'til the cows come home, but this is my take on the issue.

It is said that God is all seeing and all knowing. He knows what's going to happen to us in our past, present, and future. So the if I were to become very religious, the idea of free will would not make sense to me. How am I supposed to believe that the I had a choice in the decisions that I make if my life has been plotted out for me? Unless my life hasn't been plotted out for me which would mean that God isn't all knowing which according to the bible isn't true.

So the real question would be is it only free will because we don't know what's going to happen? If that's the case then yes, free will is plausible. But for many, they believe that God has plotted out a purpose for everyone. Even non Christians can believe that there is some Higher Power, energy, etc. that has plotted out lives out for us. So in a way we have free will, but it's limited only because we don't know what the future holds for us. But if out lives are plotted out in advance, we can't help what will happen to us. Our life circumstances are set already...set before we were born. Or at least that's what the bible teaches.

Marriage:

I personally can't see marriage as strictly a religious affair. One, because of the family I was raised in and two, because there's so many legal affairs that go along with marriage that it's not purely religious. How is it that an athiest man and woman can get married but a gay couple can not? If a person is an athiest they don't believe in God so they are not going to get married in a church. The church is not the only place for a couple to get married.

Then there's this idea that letting same sex couples get married will "ruin" traditional marriage. How? How is one couple getting married going to ruin your marriage? The concept of marriage has been changed believe it or not. There was a time where people of different races could not get married legally. Blacks were considered less than human and having a relationship with a black person was considered bestiality at a point in time. Now if a black and a white person get married very few people think much about it. It's not a foreign idea.

So why can't the concept of marriage be changed again?

Christians:

When I say this, I do mean actual people who follow Christian teachings. I learn about this religion from the words and actions of others. There's a lot of hypocrisy and contraditions spoken by some of them. Note I say some. Most of my friends are Christians and they are very rational minded people. When I speak of "Christians" I speak of those who yell out from street corners to repent for their sins or else they will burn in hell. Those who spend their lives pretending to show love by showing the hatred in their hearts. Those who preach love but show none. Those who close their hearts to new ideas and hold tight to old traditions for fear that God will smite them. Those who sin and continue to sin, but yell at other for sinning. That's what I mean when I speak of Christians.

I can't stand to see a person's spirit being torn to shreds by people who a so closed minded and cold hearted. By people who are hiding behind the guise of religion while just being a bigot.

(Again, when I speak of these things I'm not saying that all aspects of religion are bad. There are good parts like the parts that teach love and hope. And I'm not saying that all religious people are bad. Just those that use religion to hate on others or judge others.)

I have no real problems with people being religious. I have a problem when people do not accept the hypocrisy or the contradictions. Again, this is a subject I hope to go into further once I've really don't all the reseach I can do. For now these are just my opinions. If anyone reads this and feels sorry for me or feels hate towards me my question woule be 'Why?'. What about me do you pity? Why do you want to hate me for my opinion? And by doing so do you realize that to me you're just proving everything I just said?

And if I haven't said it enough, these are my feelings and opinions. Have a different one? Go ahead and say it in an adult manner. No personal attacks, no immature actions...just calmly state your opinion. You can do your best to persuade me to agree with you, but I highly doubt anyone would succeed.